I came home from the Mormon Stories Conference and woke up sick the next morning… Not cool. Being the overachiever that I am I still went to school on Monday but got sent home sick on Tuesday. I am feeling better today, mostly, but I don’t have a voice and since I’m a Spanish teacher and I have to actually talk to the kids that just didn’t work out so well… So, not feeling 100% but well enough to be bored…
The girl I am sort of dating sent me a list of recommended movies so I have been on a Jodie Foster kick… Totally recommend Little Man Tate, The Accused, and The Brave One. All awesome movies. I always like Jodie Foster in Contact and Panic Room, but the crush has been renewed!
Also talked to a good friend on the phone for awhile and he said something that caught me totally off guard. He said to me, “Kiley if you end up going back to the church I know you’ll be ok.” It was such a strange statement to make. I have no intention of going back to the church… Yet people do it all the time and I’ve spoken to many of them at length about their choices to return to the fold…
My friend predicts that if I returned it would be to sit on a bench at church with my girlfriend and our adopted children as a gay atheist attending sans belief… I’m not saying that it wouldn’t happen, but I don’t see it. The conversation made me wonder what about me or my actions would make him think such a thing…
In trying to embrace my heritage it has been about being at peace with myself. I can’t divorce myself from the past, but it does not have to be my future… As a good friend said at the Mormon Stories Conference, despite the pain, and anger that I feel for the church, if I am being honest with myself I still love it too… Sometimes I HATE that love when I look at the problems with the church. I would never knowingly involve myself in a organization that does the things that it does, but I am involved because it was my whole life for a long long time.
Damn Stockholm Syndrome I'm sure...
Things like the Fred Karger letter written to our friend Mitch Mayne this week remind me of the bad in the organization. Memory refreshed by Mr. Karger’s letter. Prop 8. A bunch of lies. Happening again in Minnesota to one degree or another right now. The church is arguably one of the most anti-gay organizations on the planet. Heritage or not it is not a good place for me to be. I still don’t think it’s a good place for any gay person. (Generalizations much Kiley...)
Doubt is still there of course. Despite a heap of evidence that the church is not what it claims the irrational question of, “What if I’m wrong?” creeps in once in awhile. It is fleeting and driven by past emotion, but it comes up and has to be dealt with. That question is a testament to how powerful belief is. That despite knowing something in your head logically and by use of reason you can still try to bend reality around some random idea or belief and try to make things fit. Despite reason, evidence and logic feelings can make you doubt.
Continuing to have doubts about the validity of the church is just part of getting past this stuff. I think lots of people probably continue to ask themselves that question too no matter how many books they’ve read and how much they have uncovered about the church… “What if I’m wrong?”
Continuing to have doubts about the validity of the church is just part of getting past this stuff. I think lots of people probably continue to ask themselves that question too no matter how many books they’ve read and how much they have uncovered about the church… “What if I’m wrong?”
Each time I investigate that question - the idea that I might be wrong about the church - I find new answers... Each trip to the chapel confirms that I really don't buy any of it. Every read of the Book of Mormon or view of General Conference just shows that I have let go more than I think I have... A little bit more an outsider every single time.
It is good to continue to constantly review and question the evidence. Being driven by questions rather than certainty is a good way to live. You leave doors open to grow and change and become more sure of your footing.
It is good to continue to constantly review and question the evidence. Being driven by questions rather than certainty is a good way to live. You leave doors open to grow and change and become more sure of your footing.
Lovely post. This is one of those that encapsulates everything I like about your blog, including frankness, humor, endearing over-analysis (though when you think about it it's really not over-analysis), and a hopeful tone with good insights.
ReplyDeleteAww. Thanks Trev! I definitely over-think things frequently.
DeleteI really think the biggest issue most people have with leaving the church is replacing the community they are leaving behind. If you can do that, it makes things a lot easier. Sometimes we think that community can only be replaced with another religion, but there are plenty of other groups that are non-religious that can be a huge help.
ReplyDeleteI think community is a big part of why some goin back. Part of it is that family often remains involved...
DeleteSorry to brush by this thoughtful and engaging post and comment only about movies, but I just saw Jodie Foster (and Kate Winslet, etc.) in Carnage. I thought I would die laughing. I have a link to the trailer on my blog now if you'd like to check it out (the Carnage poster on the right gets you there).
ReplyDeleteHAHA - That preview looks awesome.
DeleteGive-yourself-time.
ReplyDeleteI remember the days from when I first drifted away and bursting into tears just driving by temple square (drama anyone? LOL).
In time it really just became another place. I can drive by, walk through the area and even go in for concerts and the sort and it doesn't make me long for the days I used to translate from the basement and/or went into the temple and purposely go beyond all the roped off places that I shouldn't be snooping through. It is all past me, there's no need for me to long for it.
And yet I still deal with it almost day in and day out and while I manage to navigate just fine, I have no need to be involved in it fully. I don't know if people would still call that a light symptom of Stockholm Syndrome--maybe it is because of where I live and frankly, it is all around us; my family, Jeff's family and well it really is hard to just ignore...
But trust me when I say time heals all wounds...
Hugs,Miguel
You are always so insightful! I agree that this is something that we probably continue to deal with on a daily basis. It does not go away. What changes is our own views and approaches... Family is always there to bring it up again.
Delete((HUGS))
When I have doubts, I remember how miserable I was. One of the final straws was the realization that I didn't want to live the eternities the way members described the Celestial Kingdom. I just didn't. And I DEFINITELY didn't want to spend it with the people who knew they were going there. The way I see it, even if it IS all true, they can go to the Celestial Kingdom, and I'll go anywhere else, and I'm okay with that.
ReplyDeleteYeah - remembering the misery really helps put things into perspective for me.
DeleteI've always been a journal keeper and I've bawled as I have reread old journals from my believing days. They were filled with pain, guilt, anger...
Amen to that Jen! I said that too, "I don't want to be stuck with a bunch of mormons in the afterlife! No way!" Haha.
DeleteDoubt in reasonable measure is healthy. Doubt reminds us that there is more to know. Used properly, it is a good tool.
ReplyDelete"Doubt reminds us that there is more to know."
DeleteI LOVE that! So insightful. Its getting added to my quote wall.
Sometimes we all have doubts. I just have to remember where I was. How I felt in it. The things that don't resolve with reason. If it were all true, shouldn't those things be verified, not proven false. For some if it's not even a "there's no real answer" but rather proof of its falseness. The Mormon God doesn't consistently show love to all man, but seems to make tons of qualifiers to enter his presence when He knows we're imperfect. That seems like a theology that just doesn't line up. I love this post though. I love how open and honest it was.
ReplyDeleteWell, and what you are getting at is what I thought would happen. I thought upon study that many things would be verified and resolved. I did not expect to find the church proven false...
DeleteI try to be honest... Sometimes there is a lot more I could say...
Same for me. I was trying to find proof that it was true, not that it was false. And there's often more I could say, but I feel conflicted because nice girls don't say stuff like that [I know you know what I mean]. I wish people would not take my non-belief so personally. Instead of hearing why I think they way I do [or why others may think ways they do] they just hear "anti-anti-anti" oh well.
DeleteI feel comforted by your posts.
ReplyDeleteI'm glad!
DeleteSometimes I feel the gap dividing me and Mormonism growing more and more wide and that instead of accepting that the crevice is impossible to cross and moving on, I stand at the edge looking across to the other side as the separation widens. I already feel myself straining to be able to see the side I once was a part of and often ask myself why I am still looking back like Lot's wife.
ReplyDeleteI guess, like the story in the bible, if we stand at the edge looking back long enough, we do become dust. We will die still asking ourselves why we watch. I feel myself getting ready to bid farewell once and for all. Why does it still hurt every time the church releases a statement against gays? Perhaps once my back is turned, I will find peace. I'm sure I will still wonder what could have been had times been different... but I suppose it will be like a passing dream instead of a harsh reality.
That is a very powerful analogy... "If we stand at the edge looking back long enough, we do become dust. We will die asking ourselves why."
DeleteThank you for that!
I like what you are saying. I have long felt that you that you felt that if moving on does not happen then surely I can't progress, but I think in some ways that is still a very black and white thinking sort of idea.
DeleteI like the idea of moving on. I like the idea of not having to look back, but every phone call with a family member and every visit home bring the things up again. I almost feel that I am walking parallel paths with family and friends. They are on the Mormon side of your divide and I am on the other. I can't span the distance but I can't leave loved ones behind completely either.
If my family were not involved I think it would be easier to just walk away from the gap, but there they are...
Good points. I think you are right. We can never fully turn our backs if we have any desire to stay connected to our past... and of course when family is involved, we want to stay connected. So then how do we do it? How do we stay connected to the good parts and not be affected by the bad?
DeleteThat is the question... Maybe really I am deluding myself. Maybe we really can't. Most of the compromise seems to have to come from the side of the nonbeliever...
DeleteI never have a moment where I think, "What if they're right?" Never. I probably did in the past, but not now. It's funny that you say this though because I was just thinking that I could probably go back to being a mormon now because I am celibate (divorced and dumped, seeing no prospects and it's depressing!) I mean, NOT HAVING SEX was like the most important thing in mormonism! I mean it was okay if you were married, but you should certainly never talk about it or ADMIT that you did it. LOL. Ah, mormonism. I don't really have very many fond memories of it. If I am really honest with myself, I was mostly miserable when I was a mormon, but back then I really "had a testimony that it was true." How could I not have? It had been beat into my brain as fact from the moment I was born... Now I know better and my world is so much bigger and better. (Even though it's kinda shitty right now, it's still better...)
DeleteIt is never a serious question though. Nor is it really conscious. It just pops up once in awhile.
DeleteI agree - sex and Mormonism is a very interesting subject. Soooo much shame, fear and guilt thrown into it. Sex was such a bad thing... Totally vilified. A sin next to murder if you had it outside of wedlock? Really? Next to murder? Like every orgasm kills an angel in heaven or something?
Like you I was pretty miserable. Though I have managed to forget how that felt most of the time.
"Like every orgasm kills an angel in heaven or something" -that's priceless!
DeleteHere's another good one--Every time you have an orgasm, Jesus cries blood.
ReplyDeleteLOL. We should get a whole list of these going!!!
DeleteEverytime you have an orgasm, Satan's wife has a baby. :)
Delete